'86 Safari Wagon Looses Power on Inclines

Hi All,
I just bought an 86 Safari wagon, 36K miles. However, heading home the other day when going up a pretty steep hill, the car lost power climbing the hill and went from about 50mph to about 30 mph and was struggling to get over the hill (was bucking a bit). Once over the hill it was smooth sailing.

Also, just after filling the car up for the first time, it stalled out, but that hasn't been a problem since.

Any ideas?

Thanks.

Ryan

 

Seeing as you just got it I would start with checking for vacuum leaks and changing the fuel filter, esp since you say it has stalled once, and has problems maintaining speed. Did you hear any pinging while attempting to accelerate at highway speeds?

 

No pinging on the highway at all, it is smooth sailing.

Only trouble is on inclines when it looses speed.

I know how to check the fuel filter - how would I go about checking vacuum lines?

BTW you are in Manchester? I'm up by Lebanon NH - small world

Ryan

 

Hello Ryan,

Ok, well lack of pinging is good, so we can rule timing out for now. As far as checking vacuum lines, at this age, regardless of the mileage, I just replace due to experience with my two 307 powered Caprices.
But if you are short of time to replace them all, in the meanwhile try to curve them around a finger and see if there are any dry rot cracks, and pay attention by the front of the intake manifold, I found a few huge leaks there, under the alternator rear brace. I would start with the fuel filter 1st, due to ease of replacement and especially with the low mileage, who knows what bad fuel/debris may caught in your filter. The bucking I have experienced with a clogged filter, shutting it down and restarting it cured the problem for a few thousand feet and then it would repeat.

Yes, I am- I saw you are in VT and thought the same! I used to do deliveries for an Armored Car company up your way, but haven't really had a reason to come up there for about a decade now.

 

If it runs "fine" just loses power under load, either you have a fuel delivery problem or a breathing problem.


So, filters, Fuel, quantity and pressure. Disconnect cat and see if your troubles magically disappear. Well I guess that is impossible with a 307 :evil: but seriously not a mountain climber of a car!

 

I had a 90 Olds Custom Cruiser for years, so I know the degree to which these cars are underpowered -but this is above and beyond that. If the hill isn't too steep, it maintains, but anything over about a 6% grade it looses power. And I live in Vermont in the Green Mountains, so not a good thing

Has a new fuel filter. Vac lines all look good to me.

Thanks!

 

I assume no Check Engine Light. Have you checked for codes?
So did you just change the fuel filter since you initially posted- has there been any change? I hesitate to suggest to change your fuel pump, as I am just not sure. I will consult my shop manual to see if I can come up with any new ideas.
I can relate about the 307 being overmatched in a wagon against hills. My other '87 Caprice can barely do 55 up an incline at 143K, with a serious case of blowby.

 

No check engine light is on at all.

I don't know how to check for codes on this car.

The fuel filter was changed by the previous owner 1 month ago, I had forgotten he had mentioned this.

A similar thing happened with my old Custom Cruiser and I replaced the fuel pump and it resolved it, but the car was stalling a lot more than the Safari is.

If you have any other ideas, do pass them on.

Thanks!!

 

Hi Ryan,
Ok- since you mentioned that the filter has been changed recently by the PO, i would check to see if it was installed correctly as that would cause a restriction in fuel flow.
There is the gasket, or teflon tape on the brass fitting on the carb inlet- check to see if there is an excess amount of tape present (more than enough to coat the threads). The filter should have the rubber end with the hole in the center pointing outwards, with the spring seated behind it on the solid brass end.

In reference to pulling codes, the connector is under the steering column. It may still have the black cover on it marked "Diagnostic Connector". If not, it is a 12 pin connector- lettered A-M from right to to left, top to bottom. With the key in the on position(engine not running) you want to connect Terminal A (top right) to Terminal B (directly next to it). A paper clip works well for this. This will prompt the SES light to begin flashing. A Code 12- which is one brief flash, a pause and two additional brief flashes. This will flash three times. If there are trouble codes, they will begin after this followed by code 12 indicating the display of stored codes is complete. If there are no codes stored, the code 12 will continue to flash until the jumper is removed.

 

I'd also make sure it's got a good O2 sensor, good knock sensor and a working thermostat with the proper temperature rating. The ECM might not be controlling the timing and mixture correctly if those sensors and/or thermostat are not functioning perfectly.

 

There is one sure fire way to check for vacuum leaks. Use a propane blow torch, NOT LIT, and turned low. Run it over the lines, and pay particular attention to the edges of the intake, the throttle body and anywhere else there is a gasket. If the idle increases, you've found a leak.

 

Sounds like a classic plugged cat converter but at that mileage it's tough to believe. Are you able to get the wagon up to 85mph+ on a flat stretch or does it feel like she's running out of breath somewhere below that?

 

Pontiac Safari 1987

It ended up being the carburator intake manifold - we repaired this and the problem resolved.

Side question - what is the normal standard operating temp of an Olds 307 engine? When climbing a steep hill, the engine can get to about 230 degrees - but on normal roads runs around 190 degrees.

Thanks.

Ryan

 

I was going to guess check the float level on the carb, it might have been too low.

On the temp question, it may be a restriction of airflow through the radiator core itself. Pressure test the system and ensure the radiator cap is holding the recommended pressure, check for leaks, make sure no hoses are bulging or collapsing, and then wash out the fins on the radiator itself. If it's still doing it, it may be time to check other things like the water pump which could be functioning but have a worn impeller (the blades or spinning loose on the shaft) and they may not be moving enough fluid under load.

 

One of my Caprices is doing the exact same thing- with the running hot on hills and fine on flat ground. I first noticed it after I replaced the intake manifold gasket on it(307). I also replaced the water pump with a new ACDelco unit, replaced all the hoses, new radiator cap and thermostat. The radiator itself was virtually new, replaced by a PO. Nearly left me stranded during a camping trip last summer. I rarely drive the car now, so it's not crucial to solve my issue, but it does make me wonder. The one thing I didn't do was pressure test the system.